Saturday, 19 July 2014

MH17 - Hard questions for the US to answer

We have become used over the past few months to a constant stream of intelligence from US satellite and airborne surveillance, channelled through the Ukrainian authority. It has effectively monitored the size, composition and formation of Russian units on the border, has spotted the movement of just three tanks across the border from Russia to Ukraine and has provided Ukrainian units with detailed intelligence on the armour and other fixed defences of the rebels. It is quite inconceivable that the US did not know of the presence of a SAM 11 (BUK) air defence system deep in rebel territory - and particularly so if its target-acquisition radar had been active. 

They question they must answer is who did they tell. No airline in the world would continue to route flights over an area if it had been warned explicitly of the risk of a live SAM 11 system in unstable hands. So just who did the US tell? 

10 comments:

Timothy Davis U.S. of frakken A said...

I do not think they told anyone. The system here is feeding off all the chaos. The more choas that is created the more mister sotero likes it.

The system is packed with arsonists who are enjoying the burning.

Anonymous said...

The Malay Mail Online:

KUALA LUMPUR, July 18 — Malaysia Airlines (MAS) said tonight that it was told to fly low over Ukrainian airspace by ground controllers, putting it at 33,000 feet, just skimming 1,000 feet above restricted altitude.

In a statement here, MAS explained that MH17 had initially filed a flight plan requesting to fly at 35,000 feet above Ukrainian territory, which it described as close to the “optimum altitude”.

“However, an aircraft’s altitude in flight is determined by air traffic control on the ground."

“Upon entering Ukrainian airspace, MH17 was instructed by Ukrainian air traffic control to fly at 33,000 feet,” the national carrier said.

http://www.themalaymailonline.com/malaysia/article/ukraine-traffic-controllers-instructed-mh17-to-fly-lower-mas-says

Steve

Sebastian Weetabix said...

Makes no odds. An SA-11 is just as deadly at 35,000 ft.

the doctor said...

This has just been released :
The Spanish air controller also said that the MH17 flight was escorted by Ukrainian fighter jets minutes before it was downed.

The presence of the Ukraine fighter jets reported by the Spanish air traffic controller was confirmed by eyewitness reports in the Donetsk region:

2 Ukrainian fighters seen following Malaysian jet.

Source: Tweets by Spanish Air Controller - @spainbuca

10:21 – 17 de jul. de 2014

Kiev Authorities, trying to make it look like an attack by pro-Russians.

10:25 – 17 de jul. de 2014

[Miitary] has taken control of Air Traffic Control in Kiev.

10:35 – 17 de jul. de 2014

They are threatening us in the control tower at Kiev airport.

11:48 – 17 de jul. de 2014

The B777 plane flew escorted by Ukraine jet fighter until 2 minutes before disappearing from the radar.

11:54 – 17 de jul. de 2014

2 jet fighters flew very close minutes before; wasn’t downed by a fighter.

12:01 – 17 de jul. de 2014

Shot down by Kiev. Here we know it and military air traffic control also.

13:31 – 17 de jul. de 2014

Military confirm It was Ukraine, but still does not know where the order came from.

15:26 – 17 de jul. de 2014

The report indicates where the missile had come out [from], and specified it is not from the rebel areas.

16:06 – 17 de jul. de 2014
Military commanders here (ATC) control tower, confirm that the missile is from the Ukranian army.


Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 was escorted by two Ukrainian fighter jets until 3 minutes before it disappeared from radar.

Radar records were immediately confiscated after MH17 had been shot down.

Ukrainian military air traffic controllers, in internal communication, acknowledged that the Ukrainian military was involved.

Some Ukranian military chatter said they did not know where the order to shoot down the plane originated from.

Ukrainian millitary escorted B777 until 3 minutes before ... / 2 Ukrainian Fighter Jets Escorted MH17 before it was Shot Down
On 16 July 2014, the Ukrainian military deployed a battery of Buk anti-aircraft missile systems near Donetsk, where the Malaysian plane came down.


The images that accompanied this have not reproduced .

Anonymous said...

The air corridor over Ukraine is well known and well traveled.
Why would a plane that's traveling west-to-east, on a known route, be seen as a potential threat to anyone on the ground?
The act to launch a SAM would have to have been deliberate - they don't launch 'accidentally'.
Russia (and pro-russian activists) would know that shooting down a civilian aircraft would be a propaganda coup for the other side so why take that risk?
If anyone wanted to discredit the pro-russian activists and the Kermlin then 'maybe' they'd have the reasons necessary to commit such an attrocity.
It's not as if the pro Ukrainian side don't have access to similar SAMs.
Claims of pro-russians hiding evidence could equally be seen as pro-russians protecting such evidence.
The media response to the Kremlin/Putin has been hyped to unrealistic levels (given the hypocricy of the Americans and their support for insurgents when it suits them).
The BIAS against Russia across the MSM is blatant and well OTT.
Who has most to gain?
Who has most to lose?

Mike Spilligan said...

Anon at 16:57 : I agree, it seems so pronounced that it could be the FCO talking - or probably repeated without question. Your whole comment puts a clever perspective on this "accident".
US airline captain Sullenberger (who successfully ditched in the Hudson a couple of years ago) said on one of the main US TV stations that their airlines have been diverted around eastern Ukraine for several months. Why not everyone?

G. Tingey said...

the doctor
Baron Putin paid you well has he?

Sorry, not buying it.
The give-away is the boasting by the "pro-Russian militia" that they have downed a Ukrainian Mil-transport, followed by hasty backtracking & attempts (totally futile, of course) to wipe the records.

Mile Spilligan.
Flights are NOW being diverted, they were not before & tracking data is available.

Given Putin's record in Georgia etc, I'm not buying the "Poor, slandered ex-KGB agent line.
Not one little bit.

Span Ows said...

G. Tingey. many airlines (Not just US) have been diverting for months, some since March so what you say doesn't stack up.

Doctor "just been released"? That was out on the 17th and his Twitter account was blocked shortly afterwards (see RT in Spanish 17 jul 2014, 20:15 GMT). I actually asked him who the foreigners in the control tower were (further tweets spoke of oddly rapid response by Ukraine military and "What are doing foreigners with kiev authorities in the tower? Gathering all the information")

Mike Spilligan said...

G.Tingey: "Sully" is an "expert" on civil aviation retained by CBS or CNN. Can you explain why he would say that, when, if untrue, it would immediately be refuted by scores of others in the US airline industry?

G. Tingey said...

Putin appears to be backing down, without, of course admitting anything.
He is correct in one thing, of course, that if fighting had not flared up again, about 6 weeks back, none of this would have happened, because, lets admit it, there are hot-heads & total idiots on both sides of this unnecessary conflict